The first rule of business for painters: Thou Shalt Not Lower Your Prices.
Outside of the art world, I’m not aware of any other business that has such a rule. Why do we have this rule?
A few reasons:
We believe good work should have good prices and that one day a market will rise to meet our prices.
We worry that we will be unable to get our prices back up.
We worry about what a cheap price tag says to a potential collector.
We worry about the gallery math (price minus the 50% commission.)
We worry that our current collectors will be upset that their investment is losing its value and feel that they overpaid.
We worry a lot.
The problem is this: markets require flexibility or they don’t work. A typical business wouldn’t be in business for long if the owner were not permitted to lower his prices. If the economy went down, sales would go down; since he couldn’t lower prices to meet the lower demand, he’d have to either make draconian cuts in expenses or start moonlighting while he waited for the next upswing in the economy.
Since we typically don’t have much to cut in the way of expenses, we painters tend to take the moonlighting route…
I’m beginning to think that painters are harming themselves by not pricing their paintings to move. Even if the work sells for less than what we feel it is worth, I think selling a painting is always a good thing: for starters we get the satisfaction of knowing somebody is appreciating our work… and they won’t appreciate it any less just because it is affordable. Also, the painting is now in someone’s home (rather than in storage at the gallery) on a wall serving as an advertisement—an advertisement we got paid for. Lastly, and more importantly for our prices, a momentum can develop… the more we sell, the more collectors we have, the larger the mailing list gets, the bigger the openings, the more demand there is for the work. Then maybe prices start to rise again but this time the rise is based on a real, honest demand that we understand and know. The prices might even go beyond what they once were in the first place (so our collectors are happy again with their investment.)
Galleries or no galleries, I think we need to adjust our thinking about this just like we are beginning to adjust our thinking about art and the Internet.
Frankly, I’m still wrestling with many of these questions myself and would be interested to hear what you think.
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1 week ago
27 comments:
I'm battling the pricing of my work and having a difficult time with it. Recently sold four of my paintings to a multi-millionaire who is a good friend. But he likes a bargain so I lowered my prices. Now I regret it very much. Did see them framed and they look wonderful in his home. But it still hurts to have let them go at such a bargain. However, artist's have bills to pay and in the long run we have to sometimes sacrifice.
Hello Duane,
Good entry, thanks for starting the conversation.
I've been a self represented artist for about 2.5 years now. It started as a hobby (the selling, that is) on eBay. I began selling the work I accumulated while I earned my BFA. And wow, my works was going for cheap. I didn't mind at all, because it was selling and it was exciting. Eventually, as my work got better and I started to understand more, my prices went up. The eBay market ended up determining my prices. And I adjusted to that.
If things ever slow down, I panic. And worry. One painter friend of mine had some good advice, in that if you want to sell your own work, you have to be an entrepreneur first, then an artist. When you're sitting in front of the easel, you can be all the artist you want. When the paint is dry and it's time to sell, turn in to an entrepreneur.
I want to make point that you should never approach the easel as an entrepreneur. That will never work.
The price tag is very psychological. I know a painter who is exclusively gallery represented and is used to seeing the gallery price tag on his work. And selling for any less would make him feel less an artist. I asked him if he would ever sell it for half the price and got 100% of the profit. Nope. He'd never do it. He'd figure he'd lessen the value of his work, even if he was essentially making the same in the end. And if he sold twice the work at half price, he'd be making twice as much. Nope. Still no interest.
The best thing that ever happened to me as an artist is being able to sell my work at a regular and frequent pace. I'm not sure I would have had any motivation at all to continue if my work was sitting in a pile in the corner of my studio, or stacked up in a galleries storage. Instead I continually paint what I want to paint and enjoy every minute of it. And I owe this in large part to my "reasonable" price tag, that I set and am completely comfortable with.
It's an interesting topic. When I first started selling my paintings, I based my prices on advice from friends in the business, and from surveying prices of similar work in my area. It was a reasonable enough strategy, but it also turned out to be wrong; I didn't sell very much work.
After a year of this, I decided to lower my prices. Psychologically this wasn't too much of a problem for me, but I also knew I wanted to do this one time, and one time only; continuous downward adjustments seemed like a Really Bad Signal to be sending. The pricing I settled on meant a small drop in prices on the low end, but a much larger cut on the upper end.
It worked; almost immediately I began selling more regularly (including pieces that hadn't budged at the higher prices). Since then, I've only made one change, to make some prices more consistent, but otherwise I haven't felt the need to modify it.
There were a handful of people who purchased from me before the price change that I'd developed a personal rapport with. I did explain the change to them, and not only did they understand my rationale, but they've continued to buy my paintings.
Though it's tempting to think otherwise, for me it's become really important to view myself as simply a small business owner, albeit with an unusual product (as small businesses go). This keeps me from getting too emotional about the decisions, and as a result, I think I've made better decisions. Personally, there's absolutely no doubt that it's better to sell a painting at a reduced price than not at all; it's been my experience that people who buy one painting, often enough buy two paintings, and so on...
Hi Jeff, thanks again for your input. At the time you lowered your prices, were you in a gallery? If so, how did they take the idea of a price decrease?
And June, I think we all know how that stings (selling a painting for a song)but I think there are a few things to remember: those four paintings are now in a multimillionaire's home looking, well, like a million bucks.. and his family and friends will see them. Also, think of the sale for what it is-- a long-term strategy to get your prices up to where you believe they belong, not a reflection of their quality.
And Chris, I've heard many painters have the same attitude as your friend and I can totally understand it. I think many painters simply feel that the business world can creep into the painting world all too easily. This is true to some extent and it is something that requires careful vigilance to prevent. We artists tend to be suspicious of the business world, even though selling work through galleries is the same situation. We like sausage but just don't want to know or see how it's made.
Hi Duane,
I wasn't in a gallery, so it made the process easier. If I had been, I probably would not have changed the prices of anything currently displayed, but waited until pieces sold or were rotated out to replace them with the lower-priced paintings.
It seems like the kind of issue where it would be hard to predict how a gallery owner might react.
Good topic, the price nightmare. I price my work by how long it takes me, I have an hourly rate, its not huge, not as large as my lawyer, or my accountant, about the same as the guy who came to fix my computer, but he added traveling time and I dont! I think that is a very reasonable way to work out a price, I do have to make a living, I am the breadwinner for my family, and always have been. I work very hard to make a living and would like to charge more after all when someone asks "how long did that take you?" I feel like saying "about 40 years" because that is how long I have been painting, but then the price tag would be just mad! So I fix a price to what I feel is good, I also really like the concept of affordable art.
well I am a business owner (since 1988) and an entrepreneur, I've done juried shows for over twenty years, I am a member of FLA watercolor Society and local arts centers. i've juried at least one festival, taught painting and I have had an ebay store for about 2 and a half years.
Pricing is tough any time but Duane you have rewritten the ceiling on ebay prices. three years ago most powersellers who sold their art were getting about 60.00 for a 16 x 20. Neil and Karen Hollingsworth were getting between 150 and 200 but they were the exceptions not the rule. Two of your pieces, incredibly small, on PAPER mounted on masonite sold in the stratosphere. Gone are the notions of size, gallery wrapping, COA's, shipping enducements etc. Now there really are people excited by and purchasing art. And willing to pony up real money. I noticed that ebay has taken note as well. oil painting is listed as a favored category for buyers.
I price my ebay offerings based on time. Labor Ready charges about 14.00 an hour for unskilled guys who will fill dumpsters and do manual labor so I figure that 15.00 an hour is minimal. Minimum wage is 6.40 an hour so if you aren't making at least that well yikes!
I would rather paint for a living than work at walmart or the depot plus there are no retirement issues, no office politics and your customers are not in your face whining about price and wanting something for nothing.
I agree that it is better to move artwork rather than have it sit in a gallery or a studio. That is so true that having your paintings in someone's home is great advertisement. I know a painter who gives her paintings to good friends and when her friends have people over they comment on the beautiful paintings and inquire on how they can acquire one. She then charges a fairly high price for those that want one of her paintings.
Great discussion! Here my two cents or if I can't get your attention, my 1 cent.
I think the first thing to ask yourself is what is my goal in marketing? Am I introducing myself,am I new, do I want to clear out inventory, do I want to reach more people? And the second is where does my merchandise fit in the marketplace?
I agree with Jeff, collectors usually start with 1 item and if they like what you do, they will buy another. Consistency is important.But that is consistency in style and quality. That does not mean creative marketing can not or should not be used to generate more sales. I guess when I hear about lowering prices, I think SALE ITEM. A sale or special offer is a great marketing tool. There are ways to lower prices and not make it look like your work is of any lesser value. The first step in marketing is generating interest and grabbing the clients attention. Sales is the second step. Keeping returning customers is the third.
Duanne is correct, every market has ups and downs. To stay in a market you must find your place and navigate the market like you are steering a ship. First though, clearly set your course.
Hi Duane,
I'm enjoying reading your blog and reading your ideas about selling. I enoy your painting process as well. I am an art dealer in Santa Fe, NM and have sold sell high end contemporary art for many years. I've had the priviledge of talking to many well known collectors over the years who have built fabulous collections. Many of them started collecting when they were young and didn't have much money. They often put art on lay away and later wound up with masterpieces worth hundreds of thousands or dollars, sometimes millions. Great stories. So yes, encourage the newer artists to sell their work rather then hang on for the last dollar. Get it out there where it can be seen. If I can answer any questions for you that may help you or your readers to demystify this end of the art world, it would be my pleasure to try. Best wishes,
Cynthia Drennon
Interesting thread. I was intrigued by your ebay auctions. It's the first time I've seen good paintings there.I see that other people are copying the one-a-day idea. I'm using time spent as a rule of thumb for pricing, ie £100 ($185 at today's rates) per hour as a minimum level. Love your videos by the way.
I can't tell you how happy I am to have discovered your blog tonight, and in particular, this conversation about pricing art.
I'm in a transitional stage right now with pricing, and everyone's input has been quite helpful. I am learning that consistency does seem to be a golden rule worth following. When I first started showing/selling my art, I'd say I had the "rollercoaster approach" to pricing. I had some great sales and some crazy losses (another ebayer here). Now I know a buyer is willing to pay for what they like, and prices all over the place are confusing. I also know not to overprice my work anymore, in fact what Jeff said about adjusting his prices really struck a chord. Good call, my man.
I also hear what Chris is saying..."If things ever slow down, I panic." Oh boy, do I know that. That's when I have made some drastic calls with pricing, and it's always burned me in the end. I end up thinking "next time that happens, I need to just ride it out". I've discovered that when the marketing element of my life is slow, it's time to focus on the creative side. By the time I come up for air, things have picked up again.
Thanks again for this fantastic blog and conversation!!
The Question of Pricing has been on my mind for the last year or so, my work is represented with 5 good art galleries in Athens, Greece. I decided to make a final adjustment this October after 2 paintings of mine showed up at Sotheby's & Bonham's last May 2006. So I decided in agreement with my gallery "partners" @50/50% and retail price is now 1.00 Euro [$1.25] per square cm [or 0.16in] for the next 2 years, I find stability over 2 year periods are more affective. Paintings by emerging artist are like 30year bond investments, while mature [over 50] artist are keeping with 3x the inflation rate, grand master painters [dead for 10 years] prices are like the art stock market up and down on real time auctions.
Dimitris,
I like how you've articulated a few categories of art (art by the young, art by the old, and art by the dead) to make sense of the market. I tend to assume the market is arbitrary and irrational because this was Marx's rejection of it -- but there are patterns like supply and demand that we can learn from as artist-entrepeneurs.
While I would not want to incorporate dying into my business plan to increase the market value of my artworks, for example, I will get my own EBay experiment up and running to take advantage of the Christmas market before a thousand artists try to implement their own Painting-a-Day blogs as part of their New Years' Resolutions! :)
While I am being brave enough to post, I would like to give a big thank-you to everyone participating in this discursive space. I am learning, planning, fueling my artistic excitement and my logical business process by watching and listening to those who are pioneering this burgeoning field.
A brief request also, to Duane and anyone else interested: If you have the time and inclination, would you please offer your thoughts on finding one's niche? It seems to me there is an artistic and a market-analysis aspect of this.
Artistically, for example, I know that I do not have the command of light and dark, of depth perception that makes Duane's work anchored and classically beautiful. He situates things in space in a way that I can't see them situated in real life, yet it is acutely real. My strengths lie more in color and form -- and by form, I mean flow, the sparklewing flow of the inspiring reality that I see and paint, that others do not see. It is a very different sort of realism, a different concept of what representational art is and does.
I need to continue to explore and develop my own, recognizable style with this in mind -- and I also need to keep researching how to pinpoint the markets that are more interested in this style. Any particular ideas on how I might continue to do this would be much appreciated.
Artists and sages, pour forth your wisdom!
Best regards,
Katelyn Sack
This discussion touches on what I've found so interesting about the current momentum of the online marketplace for art. Who would have guessed that eBay would be such great teacher? I can't think of a better guage – a real-world indicator of what any given piece of work is actually worth than to throw it online and see what happens. I remember a time, not so long ago it seems, when I was completely bewildered about what to charge for a painting. $50, $500, $5000 – it seemed that any price point could be justified depending on how you spin it. What eBay (or any other large accessible marketplace) does is clear away much of the fog. It provides easy access to hard data on what actual buyers are willing to pay. I've found the eBay experience invaluable.
David Jamieson.
I'm afraid I must disagree with your position, Vitruvian. Marx rejected markets precisely because they are irrational. I've found the eBay market to be a lesson in marketing, not in market forces.
Hi Katelyn, the market has never been a consistent judge of quality and I, for one, am certainly not suggesting that.The market is a tool and history is full of bad work that sold well because someone knew how to use that tool and, of course, the opposite is true too.
Thanks for your kind clarification, Duane. It is exciting to see the confluence of artistic talent and marketing know-how working so well for you! I really appreciate you sharing your knowledge and progress.
Hello
Great topic, pricing one's paintings - my perpetual nightmare at the moment, a fraught and thorny issue.
I've debated it endlessly with my family and friends, who usually tell me that my paintings are too cheap and that I should put my prices up and not down; that low prices put people off because of what it says about my work (i.e. "this painting can't be any good/worth buying because it is so cheap".)
My paintings do sell, but slowly.
(If only the people who buy my paintings would tell me what they really think of the price they paid?!)
So, following general advice, a few weeks ago back i put the prices UP on my work exhibited in a local cafe - they still haven't sold any faster, so I don't think it was the low price putting people off!
Now I'm wondering about Duane's post and the line that made me laugh "Thou shalt Not Lower Your Prices"! Am I brave enough to go back and price my work even lower than it was originally? To 'lose face'?
After reading the other contributions to this post, I am considering it. At least i might free up some wall/closet space and cover the expense of my materials, ready for the next project...!
Thanks to Duane for starting the conversation.
Hi Duane,
There are only three reasons for an artist to lower his price; 1, a collector is purchasing more than one work; 2, a collector is paying in US greenbacks on the spot; 3, a real friend just has to have it, but can't afford the full freight.
I've long thought that art was sold just like rugs, by the square foot. And just like purchasing anything in a store there is a mark-up. Serious collectors know that painters only get 50% when purchasing works through galleries.
Just because we make "Art" doesn't remove any of the market pressures that come to bare on the product's value. The real test of value is at auction where a winning bidder who wins a bid (setting the value at that time) then pays a commission on top of the bid. Otherwise, dealers are shopkeepers of suspect character just looking to move the goods. It's a commercial world and even Rembrandt died on the street, stone broke.
Coulter Watt.com
Whoa Coulter, that is harsh...but true. Vermeer had to pay off the baker with a painting. I live in a part of the world, the south shore of Boston, where people are reknowned as tightwads. Prices for even the best work is minimal while 40 miles away, on the north shore of Boston, the same panting might get 5 to 10 times as much. This seems to me a basic function of supply and demand as there is a much bigger audience willing to spend money on art there. So perhaps part of the answer to getting a good price is a matter of location... getting your paintings to the right audience.I guess that is prety obvious, but actually doing something about it requires some concerted effort. You must either move to the art embracing community, or get your pictures there....
Hello Mr. Kaiser,
I always have struggle with is selling old (1-2 years) or older paintings because I'm not attached to that "old era" anymore. To find proper prices for that is very hard. I think this would be an interresting issue to discuss.
Duane and friends,
Wow! I really enjoy reading these blogs and looking at your masterpieces. I am a young artist-in-training and am learning so much from everyone's discussions. I would love to get my art business up and running in the near future, and any advice that is posted should prove very helpful. There are so many things to learn and so many questions to ask, but one that pops into my head right now is, why don't you sign your paintings, or do you just sign your larger paintings?
Thank you so much!
~cindy
Greetings Artists,
Your discussions and bits of advice are very insightful and inspiration. I hope am hoping to make it in the painting world and am looking for any words of wisdom available. I love to paint, but am wondering if my acrylic paintings will have a significantly lower value than the oil paintings. All the ones on ebay seem to be oil, and I am concerned that the medium has a lot to do with the value of the piece. Am I correct? So, why aren't there many other pieces in other mediums?
Thanks so much,
Elizabeth
Hi Cindy, I sign all my paintings, just not always on the front. There are times when I feel it would be distracting on a small painting, or on one with a particularly delicate composition.
Hi Duane,
Thank you for starting the whole PAD concept. I have been painting since I can remember, but only recently tried oils. I discovered your work quite by accident and can't get enough of watching and listening to what you so eloquently communicate through words and paint. You have given me the confidence to begin posting my own work, which up to now only sent trickles of monetary reward. I have started low enough to still support my painting habit. We'll see what happens. Hope to meet you someday...or at least see your work up close.
Jan Dale (new PAD blogger)
Ahhh yes; the eternal question of a painting's worth in the "marketplace!" I just did my first outdoor tent-show, in NE Harbor, Maine, on Acadia. I met lots of appreciative,obviously well-off, mostly retired,"Yachtys," from all over the US and abroad...and didn't sell a thing! My "day job" for the past 40 years has been Illustration, so I know you have to have a very healthy awareness of your skill level, and where one fits into any marketplace, whether as a fine artist, and especially in the more commercial world of Illustration. With that mind-set, I think I'm an even better painter than I ever was as an Illustrator.
So my "product," my paintings, are of high quality. SO, I can only conclude, I was in the wrong venue, a Craft Show, where buyers were opnly interested in crafts. Plus; as of this writing, the economy still sucks! I had the pricing discussion with 2 local artists, one of whom prices her work per square inch, which I'm considering. achtys
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